| Author | Message | ||
  Mike Scott |
Carol, I got the Van Hasselt/Wagner Fix-It book. Thanks for the tip; this is just what I was looking for-very helpful. I have started painting thumbnail sketches to work out various compositional ideas, etc... Now, with the addition of some of the ideas from this book, I am making more progess. Thanks. | ||
jandrle |
I, too, have earned my living as an artist my whole adult life. But have been involved with graphic design and illustration as well as painting. And for most of the time I, too, was self employed. I do believe that having to earn a living makes a real difference in the approach I have taken toward art. I think about the commercial side a lot more than some of the other artists I know from gallery I belong to. It is very satisfying for me... but then I never much wanted a lavish lifestyle. Some of the professional art schools such as Parsons and Pratt, both in NY and Ringling in FL teach much more about the business side of art than the fine art school I attended... but I learned over time. I think yearning for more time is part of the human condition at this point in time. Guess Ididn't really have much to say here, just dittoing Kukana's post. Jane | ||
Kukana |
Mike, I am a full time, self supporting artist.My Husband is my business manager and, like any self employed couple, we work our tails off. Working at it this hard takes the fun out of it. Like Dake warned me when I decided to take my Wild Wacky Women (Fun Art) into a full fledged company, I miss my Fine Art. Finding time for my Fine art is just like any of you who have full time jobs and search for time for your fine art hobby. My fine art give me a release when I tire of drawing my Wacky Women . I love being an artist full time. It's very rewarding. It's a rush to know that my work sells but it really does become a business..and I still long for time for my hobby! | ||
Mike Scott |
I assume many of the artists here have been to art school and may be making or trying to make a living as artists. Although this has little to do with the topic of "favorite transparents", I'd like to say that I really respect anyone who has the talent and guts to try to earn a living that way. It must be a lot of work. Personally, I got into painting for a challenge and for fun, but find myself hooked on watercolor now. I sell enough paintings to buy all of my supplies which enables me to paint more and use high quality paint, paper, and brushes. It seems that there is a whole other level that one must struggle to reach to be able to really compose and paint good or great watercolors. Undoubtedly, many of you have made that commitment. Your comments are all very different and encouraging to me as I make that commitment to work harder to take my abilities to that next level. Jandrle made a comment that rings true about separating oneself from one's work in order to look at it critically for the purpose of improvement and learning. That has got to be one of the most important keys to going to the next level. | ||
Kukana |
Mike, I think the Book called "Strengthening your Paintings through Dynamic Composition" by Frank Webb is the Bible of composition. It si hard to find and very sought after. But try your local library. My library here in north Idaho has 2 copies!! very rare. | ||
jandrle |
When I was in art school, critiques were brutal... It is heart breaking to have your work shredded... but it is the ONLY WAY to learn how to separate your work from yourself. It is essential to learn to do that so that you can look at the work, its flaws, struggles etc. yourself. Then you begin to free up to grow and expand... to become an artist, not just a person who paints, and to learn how to put yourself into a painting. When an instructor takes the time to critique your work honestly, he or she is making a real investment in you. I am not sure this is clear. Help, Dake? Just that developing skills to handle healthy critiques is as essential to being an artist as brushes, paint and paper. I love to paint, have been doing so for most of my life... is rarely think of it as fun. It is work, sometimes a struggle, sometimes rewarding, sometimes disappointing, but there is nothing that compares to the feeling I get when someone buys one of my paintings, or a commission brings tears to a client's eyes... then I know that what I am trying to say is succeeding. Far more rewarding to me than one judge liking my work... though I do like that too. | ||
carol |
I've learned the most from instructors by paying close attention to their invaluable critiques. One can learn so much, not just from your painting but all the paintings she or he reviews. One workshop, the artist( who was very good), could not say a bad thing about anyones work. You could see she was afraid to hurt feelings. I've noticed the best ones start out with finding something positive, then add the "what if" "what would happen if you did this or that. Check out Tony Van Hasselt/ Judy Wagner's "Fix It" book. Just my opinion but it has some good stuff in it. | ||
Dake |
Frances, I appreciate your comments some of which i think are also true. It's nice to just paint for enjoyment without having to worry about what anyone else thinks...if that is your goal then it's a wonderful way of relaxing and is very theraputic, i do this too, i NEED to. But if you want to sell your efforts and recoup some of the expense then it's best to aim for as wide an audience as possible. You can only learn so much from yourself. Beauty may be in the eye of the beholder but there are fundamental rules that seem to bring out more beholders. Beauty is in their eye and money is in their pocket. Beauty don't buy much Archers let me tell you. | ||
Dake |
Mike, your work shows that you have the ability to handle the medium. You have not problems with your application and sence of atmosphere,the sky it's very good. I know exactly what you mean Mike, about having become enthused and wanting to jump straight in to a painting. Watercolor materials are expensive. You owe it to yourself to get the best out of them and yourself. It's great to have fun too and you certainly will when you can allow the creative energy to flow knowing the basic principles are covered. Dont be sidetracked by the impulse to slap your juice straight on the paper without thinking. The "rapid ,responsive, spontaneous" beauty of watercolor is an illusion, don't be fooled into thinking that watercolor is just all fun and no disipline. It's the most demanding of all the mediums and will bring a like degree of joy when it really works for you. YOU MUST PLAN, if you want to succeed. Once the plan is well formed in your mind and on your preliminary value, compositional plan... GO FOR IT as simply as possible and as loosly as you like...but stick to your plan. Those that choose to feel intimidated at my advice to Mike...go with your own methods...good luck to you. Because in ten years you'll still be scratching your heads, if you can find them in the in the sand or the clouds....unless one of you is called John Singer Sargent. | ||
rmarz |
mike one and one half cents woth of comment( i have only been painting for a couple of years) Great Sky! | ||
Mike Scott |
Dake, I had to absorb your critique for a bit. I see what you mean about local color being a potential trap. Using charcoal to approach the work would I suppose have the advantage of really helping to define values. This could help avoid the local color trap and help to define a focal point (aided by contrast of lightest & darkest values). I often find, also, that I get caught-up with self-contained spaces that do not relate well to the whole composition-such as the square grassy area. Until you brought that area up, I was seeing the barn as the focal point, but now I see what you mean about the light value next to the dark of the brick wall. I've renamed the painting,"Light Green Grassy Area". No, but seriously, thanks for giving me some constructive advice. That's what I am looking for. You're right about light being the important element in defining a composition. That's really the main point of watercolor:light. | ||
Mike Scott |
Frances, very nice comment. You know, when I first started painting, I approached every painting that I did as a masterpiece. This made absolutely no sense, since I had no idea how to paint. I actually got so frustrated that I quit painting. Eventually, I began again and have taken the attitude that nothing I do is a masterpiece, but simply a painting, nothing more, nothing less. Because of this, I've had a blast painting watercolors for the last year and a half. Now that I am comfortable with painting watercolors, I'm really interested in learning as much as I can to technically improve my paintings. Mostly, though, I'm interested in having fun with all of this. Thanks. | ||
Mike Scott |
Thanks for the comments and critique, everyone. I am at a point with painting where I am trying to understand and improve design and composition. I find this the most difficult aspect of art. Dake, you mentioned(focal point); doing some initial sketches is probably essential to a well-composed finished painting. Unfortunately, I have gotten away from doing this. It's too tempting to jump right in to the painting process-all of those great colors and water to play with! All the comments are very helpful. I appreciate it! Any suggestions on good instuctional books on composition and design aspects of art? Also, does anyone know of a book or a method for doing self-critiques of one's paintings? I think the only way to continually improve is to critique one's work or to get input from others. | ||
Frances |
I am an inexperienced painter,but I just wanted to say I love Mike's picture. I know there are so many experienced artists out here that have a lot of useful tips and information. But I would also like to point out that it can be very discouraging to have your work critiqued to death with all the mistakes you made and all the things you can do to make it better. Sometimes (at least with myself), it is all you can do to learn and create something (finally!) that you feel somewhat proud of. I realize that when you post your work on this site you are letting yourself in for constructive criticism. But also remember that beauty is in the eye of the beholder and that what one person may see as things that should be improved upon, another may see as perfect in their eyes. Some of us are perfectionists and some of us are more free and easy with what we do. Sometimes I almost lose hope that I should even BE an artist because there are so many things to learn to do beyond the basics that it can seem overwhelming. But I'm just going to do my own thing the best way that I can and hopefully learn a little bit at a time through my trials and errors. Create your art with what you see as beautiful and don't worry about others. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. | ||
Anonymous |
As the Bible says, it is better to get advice from a wise man rather than praise from a fool. And Dake is a wise man. Thanks, Dake, for taking the time to thoughtfully explain yet again some of the fundamental "rules" and how they might relate to this picture in particular. Many of us learn from what you say. And, Mike, a little praise from a fool: I like your painting, especilly the sky. I do think the points Dake made would make it an even better painting. | ||
Dake |
Hi Mike, pretty good job with the barn. May i suggest something? ...Ok!! . I don't want to come across as being negative and I think we can use this forum as an educational tool by posting our work and asking for CONSTRUCTIVE feedback. I expect that when I post my work. There are too many very experienced and successful artists here to let that aspect drift, and it is just plain selfish to not give a bit of free advice. To my way of seeing there is an argument between dominance here. There are wonderful darks and lights and brilliant color, but which is the dominant aspect? My eye wanders a little looking for a place to rest. It's good to wander but i need somewhere to settle. The eastest way to create a focal point is to place the lightest light against the darkest dark and there are several of these places in the barn painting. Be aware of the extremely important midtones which glue the elements together and set the tone.... the mid tones are the hardest to keep in control and once that is achieved your as good as home.I find the focal point is the light grass area behind and to the left of the barn, it however looks a fairly, hmmmm...."square" place. The open door which tries to invite entry is barred by the hedge at front. There is another argument between the door ond the opening....avoid equal shapes, try to divide into thirds rather than halves. The *rule of thirds* applies to just about everything, shape, space, tone. Local color is a trap, it attracts the eye and is often the reason we choose a subject. But if you squint and stit back and observe the subject for a while the value patterns are more powerful, it is the LIGHT and it's counterpart that attracted you in the first place. Color dominance is fine but only when it lies upon the map provided by value. Hey, you don't have to follow these fundamentals but they generally work and get you that much further. I mean if you make a checklist of rules and of course add a few of your own dicsovered rules too, it makes the whole process much easier as well as building a little of YOU into your work too. You can concentrate on other factors while the composition and tonal basics take care of themselves. With w/c the planning is the most important step. I find it essential to do a tonal sketch with charcoal, just to construct the tonal patterns, shapes, composition etc. Anyway Mike, I used to chuck out AT LEAST two disasters for every reasonable painting until I decided to stick to some basic rules. I'll post some more work soon and hope that i get the help i need..rather than warm fuzzy comments. | ||
Mike Scott |
Dake has it right for simplest instructions for posting image. | ||
Mike Scott |
Hey, thanks for the help everyone. I was starting to sweat a little with all of those backslashes and whatnot. So, anyway, there's my painting. I was making a point about mixing granulating and trasparent pigments...the thing is, I'm playing around with gazing in addition to the more direct approach that I used on this painting. So, it seems that mixing trasparents with opaques and granulating pigments works ok, but need to be careful about using transparent pigments as glazes over opaques. | ||
mike scott |
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carol |
I finally found the detailed instructions for posting an image... Go to "posting pictures" in tree view( almost near the bottom) Then go to June 29th,(again near the bottom). It is explained very well there. I always have to recheck it when I post a painting. Hope this helps. Mike I know what you mean about the sun! I live near Cooperstown N.Y. and, well, we also talk of burnt umber and cobalt looking skies. It's been a pretty gloomy week here. | ||
Dake |
This is how you do it: start with the Backslash, type the word "image" then the curley brackets containing the name of the file of your image. Then you click the "post message" button. you will then be prompted to browse the disc where your file is located. just click "upload" and your cookin | ||
Sid |
Mike: I had problems too and probably dont remember all correctly--but... Start with a back slash \ not a forward slash/ Then the image title -- like "my painting" Then the curlique bracket, then the file name xxxx.jpg and then the closing curlique bracket (I don't know what they are really called.) Try this and see if it works. If no, someone with a better memory than I will jump in to help you | ||
Mike Scott |
{barn} | ||
Mike Scott |
/barn.jpg{barn} | ||
Mike Scott |
Well, back to the drawingboard on posting image. | ||
Mike Scott |
First time attempting to post image, so if it works... This is a quick painting I did using a mix of granulating pigments and transparents(quin. red and rose). Not too much glazing, more color mixing on paper. Kinda fun. My granmother would probably like this one./{barn} | ||
Mike Scott |
Update: it is rumored that the sun was sited over Buffalo, NY for a short time today. | ||
Mike Scott |
Thanks for the input, Dake. Adding the "umbers" sounds like a good idea. I love granulation effects and am biased toward the earth pigments. Lately, however I have been playing around with more transparent pigments. I have not had the greatest results combining these pigments with opaques, but I think some of the advice I have received thus far has been very helpful. When the price is right I've been purchasing new colors, but since I also limit the number of colors I use on a given painting to between 4-6, it will be awhile before I really get accustomed to a wider palette. As for the sun, it's not a big problem where I live, in Buffalo, NY. Oh, yeah, I am still obsessing on this whole glazing thing; a little time-consuming, but very interesting. Thanks. | ||
Dake |
Hi Mike, I thought for a while after reading your posting and the basic palette you describe has all the ingredients for most "traditional" landscape requirements. I guess it largely depends upon your choice of papers and techniques. For instance cobalt is often chosen above ultramarine as it tends to have a *softer* effect for skies than ultramarine especially in a wet in wet context. The quality of light in different areas of the world, the geography and weather types has a large influence on the palette chosen. I suggest close observation of local conditions, light etc and experimentation with palettes based around the core of what you have already stated. My thoughts are always toward the less is best philosophy and get a tremendous kick from pushing the subleties of raw and burnt sienna with ultramarine. Two outstanding omissions from your palette are the Umbers, burnt and raw. They are fabulous, burnt umber with ultramarine produces a magnificent dark, that is also very flexible depending on the ratios of blue in the mix, raw umber produces a warm *classical* green when combined with ultra..also..try an indigo/raw umber for a cooler but very nice green with alot of depth. Indigo is one of the strongest pigments on the planet so use it with caution. It will cool a painting like a blizzard if it contaminates your palette but is very useful for making green. A cool red is useful too, permanent magenta or perm crimson, or if your like me and want that granulation, rose madder genuine...but i feel like a psychopathic freak who just wants to rip off the punters if i mention that around here. I sell my paintings with a special frame that holds a little umbrella and a tube of sunscreen in case they want to take my work out into the sun. | ||
Mike Scott |
Dake, the basic palette I've been using consists of ultramarine blue, light red, burnt sienna, raw sienna, hansa yellow medium, and a few other assorted colors once in while. Do you have any suggestions to enhance/improve my palette as relates to painting landscapes? I really appreciate any input. | ||
Dake |
Cathy, thanks. The figures are one touch/wash of strong indian red and ultramarine.I avoid glazing as much as possible especially with these type of colours. John's advice on glazing with staining pigments is very important, I tend to avoid staining pigments. Just a personal choice and way of working, i like the ability to lift off if needed. I'm very much a traditionalist as you may have gathered from my initiation to this forum on the subject of opaque whites. | ||
Cathy |
Dake, very impressive, especially with such a limited palette. Did you glaze the silouettes to get them so dark? Beautiful painting! Thanks for sharing. Cathy | ||
Dake |
Carol, this one is on the reverse side of Saunders Waterford 300gsm(140lb)medium tooth, the back has a more pleasing texture i feel. John, it's 10x14. The luminosity of the water is largely achieved by doing as little as possible to it(in fact this water and indeed the sky are somewhat overworked even though i spent no more than 30mins on the painting...thanks to a hair dryer) I layed a wash of very weak raw sienna over the entire sheet wet on wet, i left a little white paper for the lightest part of the sky, dropped and brushed in the clouds with the ultramarine and indian red making sure to leave the distant water horizon untouched, also keeping the strong tones away from the areas of light on the horizon and foreground water(or should it be forewater). Dried it all with the hair dryer, did a graduated wash for the distant horizon, dried it, then put in the rocks...midground, dried it, finally the water was done by just making short horizontal strokes with tongue of dragon, much in the style of an impressionist, making sure to space them out more in the areas i wanted to be in the light. So there you have it...the figures go in last. Very simple and fun...although the notion of silouettes rarely makes it past the "corny" shelf, there are some wonderful artists who do it well...eg Paul Jackson, so i thought i'd have a crack at it. | ||
John Preston |
Mighty fine, Dake! I'm guessing about 5x7 or therabouts? | ||
Mike Scott |
Dake, how did you get that luminous effect for the water? It looks incredible! | ||
carol |
Dake, Nice painting. Love the granulation. Is this one on hot pressed? You spoke of a " satine" ( I think it was you) Is that a regular arches hot press or something else? Like looking at all the different paintings coming up. Everyone keep up the good work and posting. Still no answer from Lex??? | ||
Dake |
Hi all, it's been a while since i posted anything so i thought i'd show you this one done with a very limited palette; Indian red, ultramarine and a drop of raw sienna.  | ||
Mike Scott |
Just checked-out the "handprint" site. Wow! | ||
John Preston |
That's the general idea, Mike, stainers under lifters. Ultramarine falls in the middle. Had cobalt been your first layer, it might have moved around a lot. An earth color would have moved around too, probably gotten muddy, though there are some interesting greys, and even deep greens to be gotten from such combos. Bear in mind that like, or close hues will intesify when glazed over one another. Colors that are more widely separated on the color wheel will become more subdued when glazed . Supply catalogs are starting to list the staining properties of their paints now but the ultimate source for this info is our friend drollere's site: www.handprint.com It's the last word on technical aspects and handling properties of pigments as well as info on all things watercolor. | ||
Mike Scott |
John: Usually, when I glaze, I'm simply adding several washes of the same color over the same object to darken or intensify. Recently, I painted many washes of Pthalo blue over wave shadows(painted with ultramarine blue)-it is the most convincing ocean I've painted. This has encouraged me to experiment-to go beyond the limited technique I have been using. I wish to create more depth and to mix color by transparent layers rather than just by physically mixing on the palette/paper. Is there a rule of thumb as to which pigments are best to apply glazes over? Are staining colors best in this regard because they simply stay in place when glazed over? I know it is not that simple. Time to experiment! | ||
Kukana |
All the Quin are great glazers...But never glaze over an opaque. You'll get a slurry of a mess. Yuk! | ||
John Preston |
Mike, Any watercolor is potentially a glazing pigment. Best to define what you mean by glazing: If you mean one color over white paper, then the transparent pigments will outperform the opaque and semiopaque pigments. If you mean applying pigments on top of each other, then anything is potentially a glazer PROVIDED YOU ARE AWARE OF THE GLAZE COLOR'S STAINING PROPERTIES AND THE BOTTOM COLOR'S LIFTABILITY. Pthalos for instance will stain anything underneath, often creating mud. Opaque or semiopaque colors in a thin wash will glaze nicely IF the color below stays put. Perhaps thats why most watercolorists eventually get a tube of just about every thing: You need more than just X number of hues; you need a staining,lifting,granulating,warm, cool, etc. version of each hue. | ||
Mike Scott |
Does anyone have a suggestion for a small number of transparent colors to balance a traditional landscape palette (for glazing)? |
